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 Warning about a Server

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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Warning about a Server   Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:16 pm

First topic message reminder :

Hello.

So a couple of months ago there was an issue with a Hungarian server called Avalon. Basically this server had stolen all of Sanctum of Eventide's content (which now belongs to Dragon's Den) and did not remove it when I asked.

So their server was blacklisted.

For full info, go here: http://www.kitopen.com/t4807-warning-about-using-soe-content

Now the same staff have created a new server by the name of Hydra Utopia. A screenshot of an SoE critter, now belonging to DD, was on their server's facebook page for an Easter event so you know this is very recent.
Spoiler:
 
See that walking egg? Yeah, made by Hamilton. Only owned by SoE until they gave DD their content. It is now exclusively a DD critter.

Imagine my surprise when I found out their new forum, Hydra Utopia, was created 2 days before I stopped communicating with Avalon staff.

Here's the staff list for Hydra Utopia: http://hydrautopia.freeforums.net/members?dir=asc&sort=name&view=staff

Spoiler:
 

Since they clearly didn't listen the first time I am requesting Hydra Utopia to be blacklisted for theft same as before!

Blacklist here: http://www.kitopen.com/t4820-it-server-black-list

Since proof is required:

Spoiler:
 

Since it would've taken forever to gather a million screenshots I just did a video that shows some things.


In this video you can clearly see the dates on the models - some of which go all the way back to 2012 and are owned by SoE. Strange how a server created in 2017 has those.

I have not contacted the staff yet. I'm afraid I'd be rather rude if I did until I cool off a bit. I gave these guys a chance when they owned Avalon. They wanted a list of SoE stuff to remove but that would've taken forever, so I simply told them to delete what they had and download the IT 0.7 version and add their original stuff to that so there would be zero chance of them having anything from SoE. Clearly they ignored me.

For proof of this (and the dates - HU was created 25th Feb, I last spoke to Avalon staff 27th Feb):

Spoiler:
 

They said they wouldn't do another server. Apparently that was a lie.

These same staff clearly care for nobody but themselves. If you do not want thieves like this in your community or associated with IT then please make sure you steer clear of them and that they are not welcome until they change their ways. I know none of the staff are welcome on Dragon's Den.


Last edited by ObeyTheFist on Mon Apr 17, 2017 3:47 pm; edited 2 times in total
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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:23 pm

Okay, back again. Keeping things up to date.

If you're wondering about the red rectangles it was an email address - not my place to give out personal details that aren't mine like that so I blocked it. If you really want to know (why would you?) feel free to go to Hydra Utopia and ask Hydra for it.

Spoiler:
 

I...don't recall mentioning deviantART? Did I miss something?

For anyone else who believes they can skate by on such flimsy 'legal' technicalities that these people are trying to employ I assure you it will not work. Do not use content in your servers that you procured from another server such as SoE. It is wrong, lazy, greedy and downright criminal. It is theft, plain and simple. I have already put up a warning about this regarding SoE content.

EDIT: Sorry, got a reply so decided to add it here instead of double-posting! (I also blocked out the email again)

Spoiler:
 

Again, sorry for dragging everything here, but I like to make sure more than just me, or anyone affiliated closely with DD (such as my staff for example), knows what's going on.


Last edited by ObeyTheFist on Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:59 pm; edited 1 time in total
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ThylaSteve

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 12:45 pm

Where on DA can you find SoE content anyway? Unless they're making this up. If anyone finds it, it might be helpful to know so we can get it taken down.
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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 1:31 pm

Hi Steve,

I know a couple of years ago there was a person on dA who had several SoE textures as their 'art'. They were showing off 'their work' to myself and LazyZim in the hopes of landing a spot on our staff team. We immediately contacted Seb and the person's account was shut down.

The latest:

Spoiler:
 
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KittyKylo

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:46 pm

Just thought I provide the difference between FAIR USE and COPY RIGHT here for the staff to watch since they don't seem to get it.

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ThylaSteve

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 2:59 pm

KittyKylo wrote:
Just thought I provide the difference between FAIR USE and COPY RIGHT here for the staff to watch since they don't seem to get it.
Spoiler:
 

Useful advice, though some information can be misinterpreted. Such as the part about making something "transformative". One might hear that and mistakingly think that retexturing someone's work makes it "fair use".

It's always safest to get your info from official legal sources, and then contacting the owner of a work if you are still not sure.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 3:51 pm

Omg.....
It's a bit pathetic. At least I wrote a letter to Obey. (And I wait patiently for her answer) This is gas.
I agree. They ask Obey. That's right.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:05 pm

Even if Obey owns/has the rights to use SoE content, and someone did ask her to use the content she would more than likely (from my understanding) have to ask the owner of SoE if anyone else could use it which I highly doubt as if it was given away that easily I'm sure models etc would be given out for free use.
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Nightroad
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:15 pm

I do not know this.  I know I wrote to Obey on a DD server forum. And now I'm waiting for answer ^^ That's right
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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:58 pm

KittyKylo wrote:
Even if Obey owns/has the rights to use SoE content, and someone did ask her to use the content she would more than likely (from my understanding) have to ask the owner of SoE if anyone else could use it which I highly doubt as if it was given away that easily I'm sure models etc would be given out for free use.

I do not own all of it as a small number of things were kept by the original creators and so those particular things were not given to DD and we respected that.

The owners of SoE have expressly told LazyZim and myself that they are tired of being asked permission as the content now belongs to LazyZim and myself and we are free to do with it what we will. As you may recall from an earlier post, one of the owners of SoE, Mercy, told LazyZim that the content belongs to LazyZim and myself and we are free to police it as we see fit.

As a good percentage of it was created in some way, shape or form by Hamilton we generally do ask Hamilton about permissions. Over the years there have been a rare few who have gained permission to use some SoE content. (Yes, there is a chance that if ye ask ye shall receive! We're not monsters y'know)

Nothing created by any staff member of SoE for SoE, including anything created by Hamilton, is available 'for free use'. The owners of SoE gave DD their content after much debate and long, hard thought so please do not make light of their decision and take what isn't yours.

Again, no original SoE content is available for free use by anyone other than myself or LazyZim or anyone we, along with Hamilton, may give permission to.

Hydra Utopia does not have permission and this blatant theft does not fall under fair use, hence why I have been asking them to remove all SoE content.

While the majority of it now does belong to me and LazyZim, Hydra is also using those models from SoE that the original creators did wish to give out to anyone - so Hydra has also stolen a number of private models/textures etc.

Thank you for the videos KittyKylo, I feel they are helping me try and make my point. Sadly the owner of Hydra Utopia does not speak English, as everybody keeps telling me, so linking these would be a waste of effort unless one of Hydra's staff members can translate them into Hungarian and be trusted to get it right. Hungarian to English and vice versa is notoriously tricky.

Quote :
Omg.....
It's a bit pathetic. At least I wrote a letter to Obey. (And I wait patiently for her answer) This is gas.
I agree. They ask Obey. That's right.

Ah yes, I just saw your letter on DD. You apologise for your English because you 'learned German' but have a Hungarian email. You asked about other accounts and said you forgot them and would like them deleted.

Spoiler:
 

But you logged into 2 of them 3 hours ago and the newest one was only registered 2 hours ago.

Spoiler:
 

Hello Bishounen. I believe I said you were not welcome on DD. Is there a reason you are suddenly back on my forum with a 3rd account, breaking my rules and asking permission for SoE content in the same message?

I hope you'll forgive me for posting this here but I just don't trust you. If you truly do have good intentions then we will talk in front of others if the KITO staff will allow it. All the PMs I've written lately haven't gotten anyone anywhere so I think a more public talk might help. If the KITO staff object I will stick to PMs.
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Nightroad
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:01 pm

Unfortunately, my sister does not speak English. I just told her anything to ask the question. Do you tell me what she did?
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:05 pm

She did not tell me anything. But now I'm interested in the story.
By the way, I wrote that I learned German, not in English. But I'm trying to understand English.

So, somebody tells me what happened?
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:06 pm

Nope, go right ahead Obey. You have my full support on this.

Although a quick suggestion might be to try to find a good hungarian/English speaker that you trust  to help you translate back and forth?

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:09 pm

I'm trying to understand English. I came here because a sister asked me.

She told me to try to get some sort of deal to make everyone good. I do not know this game so much
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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:12 pm

Thank you KatyeKitty, it is most appreciated. I do know someone, but sadly they are unavailable right now. I will be sure to enlist their help ASAP.

It's also 3:10 AM for me right now, so after this post I am going to bed.

Feel free to leave me a message here and I will get back to it when I can after a good sleep.

Your sister? And who is your sister, Night Road?

Are you saying that you asked a question in place of your sister who does not speak English? You said you asked a couple of months ago, but your account is new.

Could you please explain as much as you can from the start?
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:14 pm

She's name Sylvie. Nickname: Bish

As you said, I said what my sister said. She just dictated the text.
I do not even know what this is all about.


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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:16 pm

The point is, she asked me to write to you. I wrote what she said and that's all. She asked me to try to make something unity that everyone is good at.

But I do not understand the problem :/ I do not know the game
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 5:38 pm

But as I watched my sister showed, quite a lot of similar games contain the same things.

I appreciate the work of every company. Can we make a compromise to make you good and keep the children in their present state of play?
I can not do that, but give me a condition. Pay or announce your game. I do not know how this is going.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 7:18 pm

Stop double posting. Edit your original or wait for a response from Obey.

The time for compromise and asking for permission over that content is over. You're lucky that I'm even allowing you to speak here at all.

Oh so is that how you appreciate creations? By blatantly disrespecting their creators by stealing the content that they generously gifted to someone else?

It is NEVER okay to rip ANY content from other servers. Is it yours? No? LEAVE IT ALONE. Don't even LOOK at the damn files. I don't care if it's public somewhere else.

SoE and DD had and has been around for a very long time. There are YEARS worth of work done that you expect to basically cheat that time through ripping it off of someone else and making yourselves look 'cool' in the process.

As far as I'm concerned there are no more conditions to be met. Remove the content or you and your sister and all of your little group will be permanently banned from this community. You can deny the theft all you want, but the fact of the matter is that that is exactly what happened here. Theft. Fix it or leave.

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:49 pm

It might also be a good idea to get proboards involved so the forum can be removed. I absolutely back the decision to take legal action as uploading and distributing stolen files can result in some hefty fines. ISP sourcing the computer hosting the server will smack them with some penalties and also result in the server being removed.

They are obviously not going to take responsibility and will more than likely continue to remake the server over and over again in a different name. Best to end it here and now with the law backing you.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:03 pm

Hydra banned me for asking them to stop stealing SoE content -.- again.

I really hate Avalon and (yes) Hydra Utopia.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:59 am

Its not hard to admit what you've done and face the music. Even if I am not directly involed with this issue.. I say just get it over it, and fix the issue. There is full proof that the content is not yours and it belongs to someone else.
(Edit: About the taking action with the law, I FULLY AGREE.)
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ObeyTheFist

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 2:39 am

Hello Night Road,

On DD you also offered to donate. I'm sorry, but I must ask you not to. It will feel like a bribe and not a gift if you do. And if you do I shall simply refund it. I do not want money from thieves or people associated with thieves.

So Bishounen is your sister? You don't even know what this is about? I suggest you ask your sister. OR you can read the original post of this thread and the links in it - that will tell you everything.

Yes, I was asked for permission to use the SoE content way back when Avalon had it. I told them no.

I was asked again last night.

Sorry, but the people involved have already stolen the content and I don't give permission to thieves. That is why I told Avalon no. Do you honestly think I would give permission to use content to people who had already stolen it?

If Bishounen is looking for a compromise then I already gave one - Hydra Utopia needs to remove all SoE content. If they do that and start over clean with the KITO IT 0.7 server starter package then there will be no further problem.

All the items that come with the original (not counting the private ones) can be found in all IT servers, along with a lot of free content people can download right here on KITO. Hydra Utopia is free to use those as I have already said.

To make sure there is no SoE content left in Hydra Utopia the owners need to delete the server and only use the IT 0.7 package and whatever they can find for free here on KITO.

Remove all SoE content and Hydra's server can stay and grow on it's own. That is my compromise. It has always been my compromise.

They will still have a server, the members of Hydra Utopia will still be able to play. But if what I ask is done then there will be no stolen content in the server and no problems between us.

Simple as that.

If I have to get the content fully registered to truly enforce my rights then I WILL. And when I do I will sue Hydra Utopia and all the staff involved for all the money I can as it seems to be the only way to protect my content and get thieves to leave it alone.

How far is Hydra Utopia willing to go to keep stolen content?

This is the last day of the 3 days I gave Hydra Utopia to start over clean.

Last day. I suggest everyone involved with Hydra does what I ask. I am not making unreasonable demands. If Hydra Utopia's server is still running at 12:00 AM tonight my time (It's 12:37 PM now) and if the download link for the game is still up then I will begin taking action.

I'm trying to be nice and giving you all a chance to fix things. Be smart and listen.

~Obey~
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Nightroad
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 12:30 pm

Dear Obey. I do not want to have a debate with you here, because you do it yourself and I do not want it. If you have a little humanity left, you leave the children alone, so they will "live" from your players. According to the Hungarian copyright rule, if we change 80% of something, we can use it. If you do not believe it, please follow me.
If you want to tell someone, do it, I'm here, but leave the kids in peace. Of course, if you have so many vertebrates that you are not an orphan, and you do not want to have a soul-damaged child revenge for what you do not get from life ... I'm happy to give you my opportunities. You can find Matthew Nightroad on Facebook. I live in a town called BUGYI.

Shere's a list of the servers they showed me, from DA


From here I randomly checked and looked at some of the children's files. I found all the same content as my kids. Just to highlight some:
Last Moon
Eldoraro
Tales Of Luzaris
Ferals Online
Dragon Soul

I'll ask you to pick up these servers and get them there. You can also put them here for the group.
In any case, what I have to say about the aid thing, I would be interested, because if you're humanly zero in my eyes, I respect your job.

By the way, I would ask you in parentheses. Did you know that Dragon's Den name is protected?
Please note that we are reviewing local legislation
I'm waiting for you on facebook if you want to continue! : 3
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:05 pm

LOL what? Change 80 percent of something and you can use it? I think not. Are you saying if you took a famous novel and kept 20 percent of it identical, you claim you wouldn't get sued? You are sadly mistaken. Not to mention, 80 percent of the SoE files weren't changed. Its a hundred percent of the game with some very crude re-texturing of models. Making a model a different color still does not make it yours.

Also, most IT servers have a lot of the same content because they downloaded what is truly FREE here from KITO, and didn't STEAL. Obey has already said that SoE's files (I refuse to call it Hydra's at this point) contains some free content and you're welcome to use that, it's the stuff that was given to Dragon's Den that needs to be removed. Stop arguing pointlessly, and just remove what IS NOT YOURS.

And you'd best learn national legislation. Dragon's Den is also a name used for a school in the UK, and two shows: one in the UK and one in Canada.

You think showing humanity is allowing thieves to keep the content they stole? If your home ever gets robbed and they steal things you have worked hard to have, be sure to keep this ignorant statement in mind.

By stealing content and uploading it for public use you have violated the terms of your service provider and if Obey chooses, she can have Hydra Utopia's forum and server shut down, and the person hosting the server, fined. Wise up before you get in trouble.

And to add: Hydra Utopia is also using models from Blizzard, which they have already asked to have removed. Reporting the server to Blizzard would result in a lawsuit.
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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:45 pm

Dear Nightroad,

Of course there are the same models etc. in those servers. Were you not listening when I said ALL servers have the same content from the IT 0.7 package and free content downloaded from here on KITO?

If you had read the copyright links I provided and the videos KittyKylo provided then you would know that there is no 'safe' percentage of modification.

When I had this issue with Avalon I was told that I was picking on children and now I'm being told again?

No. I am defending my rights and my content. If 'your children' want to commit an adult crime then I will treat them as adults.

Hydra Utopia has 15 minutes to take down their server and download link to begin removing SoE content.

Failure to do so will result in me contacting all authorities I can get involved. During the day I will be contacting legal aid and taking steps to having my content fully registered. Don't think I won't sue for theft of my content.

Seriously, do 'your children' a favour and comply with what I'm asking. Take the server down. Take the server download link down. Remove all SoE content and any content modified from original SoE content.

~Obey~
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ThylaSteve

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PostSubject: Re: Warning about a Server   Sat Apr 22, 2017 1:53 pm

https://github.com/jespersh/KITO/archive/v5.5.zip

^^^ here is the legal KITO/impressive title source download, in case you were having trouble finding it.


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